eap Mailing List: RE: RE: Comments on draft-adrangi-eap-network-discovery-07.txt

[Bari, Farooq (Farooq.Bari]

Hi Eugene,

Your comment about applicability is quite valid and was also requested by Joe - 
we do plan to update the draft for it.

BR,

Farooq

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eugene Chang [mailto:eugene.chang [at] funk.com]
> Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:19 AM
> To: Bari, Farooq; Eugene Chang; gwz [at] cisco.com; Adrangi, Farid; iesg [at] 
> ietf.org
> Cc: Lortz, Victor; Pasi.Eronen [at] nokia.com; eap [at] frascone.com
> Subject: RE: [eap] RE: Comments on draft-adrangi-eap-network-discovery-07.txt
> 
> Farooq,
> Thanks for your reply.
> 
> 1- It would be very helpful if the scope being addressed be stated. It seems
> very natural to read an RFC as an absolute statement to a problem unless the
> limits are explicit.
> 
> 2- What is ironic to me is that in a subscribers "home region" where the
> home network has the most influence, the proposed solutions works well. This
> is the very scenario that the proposed solution may not be needed. When the
> subscriber is traveling far from home, the very situation the proposed
> solution is most valuable; it is likely that the proposed solution will not
> be helpful.
> 
> I have watched the discussion for a long time. With all the issues I have
> seen mentioned (again) in the last three days, I am surprised that, the
> draft has not changes to explicitly narrowed the focus to define some of the
> issues out-of-bounds or to have changed to broadened the solution's
> effectiveness to address more of the issues.
> 
> Gene
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------
> Eugene Y. Chang
> Funk Software
> voice   1-617-497-6339 x244
> fax     1-617-547-1031
> mobile  1-781-799-0233
> AIM     gene02421
> Skype   gene02421
> email   eugene.chang [at] funk.com
> email   eugene.chang [at] ieee.org
> ---------------------------------
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Bari, Farooq [mailto:Farooq.Bari [at] cingular.com]
> > Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:51 AM
> > To: Eugene Chang; gwz [at] cisco.com; Adrangi, Farid; iesg [at] ietf.org
> > Cc: Lortz, Victor; Pasi.Eronen [at] nokia.com; eap [at] frascone.com
> > Subject: RE: [eap] RE: Comments on draft-adrangi-eap-network-discovery-
> > 07.txt
> >
> > Hi Eugene,
> >
> > All I can say is that you are not catching up on your weekend emails but
> > on last two years worth of discussions in EAP WG :)) on the draft. It is
> > difficult  for me to understand why IESG has these rules that practically
> > reset everything that has happened with the draft since it got introduced
> > long time back and require authors to satisfy everyone again from the very
> > beginning on  fundamental questions that were dealt with longtime back and
> > are hard to explain/resolve/convey over emails...................
> >
> > A very brief response (which I am sure can not staisfy you and obviously
> > can not because discussion on this topic is something that has always
> > taken a long time to converge) is, the draft does not mandate anything on
> > the part of the service provider. It is about ABNF. The information on
> > roaming partners is just a hint for the client device about hotspot
> > operators own roaming partners, and no where does it say it has to be an
> > exhaustive list of all of its roaming partners roaming partners partner
> > etc..IT is not tryin g to solve world hunger problem.  The service
> > provider, can also choose not to advertise any of its partners, a couple
> > of them or all of them if there are a handful. This draft is NOT trying to
> > address your  thousands of roaming coprorate partners scenarios but is to
> > be used by 3GPP SPs. Again this roaming partner information is just a hint
> > and I am not sure why people expect this draft to solve everyone's roaming
> > issues and problems with all the scalability to handle n possible
> > mediating partners etc. ...... to be honest I am not sure if some one can
> > design such a solution that satisfies everyone's roaming dreams.
> >
> >
> > BR,
> >
> > Farooq
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Eugene Chang [mailto:eugene.chang [at] funk.com]
> > > Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 7:46 AM
> > > To: gwz [at] cisco.com; Bari, Farooq; 'Adrangi, Farid'; iesg [at] ietf.org
> > > Cc: 'Lortz, Victor'; Pasi.Eronen [at] nokia.com; eap [at] frascone.com
> > > Subject: RE: [eap] RE: Comments on draft-adrangi-eap-network-discovery-
> > 07.txt
> > >
> > > Farid,
> > > I am sorry to be catching up with the weekend mail.
> > > Glen points out an example that is often overlooked. There are many
> > cases
> > > where the "home AAA" is the enterprise and not a public provider. This
> > > provides a significant increase in the number of home AAA. Further, the
> > > enterprises that fall into this category provide a large number of
> > roaming
> > > users so we should not be minimizing this scenario.
> > >
> > > I really would like to see an explanation of how this the network
> > discovery
> > > scheme works in a global context. I can understand how it works with a
> > small
> > > set of bilateral arrangements but I thing the scheme does not scale.
> > >
> > > Gene
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Eugene Y. Chang
> > > Funk Software
> > > voice   1-617-497-6339 x244
> > > fax     1-617-547-1031
> > > mobile  1-781-799-0233
> > > AIM     gene02421
> > > Skype   gene02421
> > > email   eugene.chang [at] funk.com
> > > email   eugene.chang [at] ieee.org
> > > ---------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Glen Zorn (gwz) [mailto:gwz [at] cisco.com]
> > > Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2005 11:46 AM
> > > To: gwz [at] cisco.com; 'Bari, Farooq'; 'Adrangi, Farid'; iesg [at] 
> > > ietf.org
> > > Cc: 'Lortz, Victor'; Pasi.Eronen [at] nokia.com; eap [at] frascone.com
> > > Subject: RE: [eap] RE: Comments on
> > > draft-adrangi-eap-network-discovery-07.txt
> > >
> > > Glen Zorn (gwz) <mailto:gwz [at] cisco.com> supposedly scribbled:
> > >
> > > > OK, now that we've established that the security properties of
> > > WLANs
> > > > are identical to those of cellular networks (I wish that Farooq
> > > had
> > > > pointed this out several years ago -- it would have saved a lot of
> > > > time in 802.11i), I guess we can dispense with any further
> > > discussion
> > > > of such things.  Furthermore, no enterprise networks will be
> > > listed
> > > > in the hints, just SPs.  Suppose, then, that Bigco.com contracts
> > > with
> > > > Consort.com to provide remote access for Bigco's employees when
> > > they
> > > > are traveling.  Suppose also that Consort.com is a roaming partner
> > > of
> > > > Megatel.com, which operates hotspots in coffeehouses around the
> > > > world.  A Bigco employee walks into a Megatel hotspot and tries to
> > > > access the network.
> > >
> > > Should have mentioned, using her Bigco.com user ID.
> > >
> > > >How does that work?  Does it work at all?
> > >
> > > BTW, this example is from Real Life -- the names have been changed
> > > to protect the innocent -- and is the simplest example of enterprise
> > > roaming/remote access I can think of.  There are _much_ more complex
> > > examples, also from Real Life.
> > >
> > > Hope this helps,
> > >
> > > ~gwz
> > >
> > > Why is it that most of the world's problems can't be solved by
> > > simply
> > >   listening to John Coltrane? -- Henry Gabriel
> > > _______________________________________________
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